Shrunken women board

by **i am insane** » Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:35 pm

Kisupure wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:49 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:39 pm
I've thought about this kind of thing a lot, and to me, power can really be reduced to simply that: choice. The ability to make a decision and then do it, no matter what anyone or anything else may say.
This is really interesting. I know a lot of dominants cheekily describe themselves as control freaks, this seems to be in that vein. So it's more about the "ease of execution" than it is about something specifically interpersonal? So if you had a machine, for instance, or some kind of technology that effectively lets you have this kind of unilateral control of everything in your sphere of influence without the need to actually interact with any other human beings (tiny or otherwise), would that be even more preferable? You'd get to eliminate even having to delegate anything, tell people what to do, try to communicate what you actually want in a way that they don't screw up or misinterpret you; it would essentially remove all human error. Maybe the tradeoff is even that you wouldn't be able to use it around others, you'd have to do it in isolation. Sort of like a Dr. Manhattan on Mars kind of situation?

Hmm... I'm not sure I'd call it 'ease of execution' so much as 'ability to execute'. Take a more dramatic example, if I wanted to, say, throw a car out of my way or something (and oh, do I get that urge in traffic) I couldn't do that, period: and it's not society would frown on it stopping me, it's not that I'd get punished for doing it holding me back, it's the fact I'm just literally unable to pick up a multi-ton hunk of metal and throw it. Which, in a way, goes back to society itself; the idea of it is backed by lots and lots of people who act to protect it, and maybe you can be Rambo, and kick disproportionate amounts of ass, but after a certain point you will lose to society. Thing is, I'm not filled with, like, this overwhelming urge to rebel or whatever, the fact I can't is what grates at me.

While I'd prefer a way that isn't so removed from me (because if nothing else, fiction has taught me a power or device separate from myself can possibly be used against me), I wouldn't be above using a machine or something like that, if it was available. I'm greedy, not stupid.

I'm a fun case when it comes to people; I'm not great with people, badly so, to be honest (oh, I can talk, and interact, and call, and small talk, and all the other bits and pieces, but I don't want to so badly it almost hurts sometimes) and yet I know I'd need to be around people, or else I really would go insane.... and probably get depressed. I don't want to work with people, or direct them in their daily lives or whatever, so in theory just fucking off to the middle of nowhere alone sounds ideal, but in practice the lack of anyone to talk to would probably end badly. Also, begging, sucking up? It sounds fun, and maybe it is in certain circumstances, but I played Julius Caesar once in a little play, and early on (before I got stabbed to death, lol), everyone sucked up to him, to me. And every time they did I wanted to fucking cringe. I'm sure that, given time, I could get used to it, and almost certainly grow to enjoy it, judging by my own tastes, but I feel like I wouldn't naturally seek out a situation where that comes up.

I think my ideal situation, when it comes to something like what you're suggesting, is more like the idea of a fairy realm or something: I live somewhere separate from everyone and everything, and I'm able to do so indefinitely, but I can leave and go interact with people if I want, and bring people in, so I don't have to suffer the downsides of isolation, preferably with me bringing the power with me so i"m not helpless outside it (again fiction, and the evil overlord list, has helped me find the vulnerabilities in all sorts of our basic fantasies, and they bother me).

by **Kisupure** » Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:49 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:39 pm
I've thought about this kind of thing a lot, and to me, power can really be reduced to simply that: choice. The ability to make a decision and then do it, no matter what anyone or anything else may say.

This is really interesting. I know a lot of dominants cheekily describe themselves as control freaks, this seems to be in that vein. So it's more about the "ease of execution" than it is about something specifically interpersonal? So if you had a machine, for instance, or some kind of technology that effectively lets you have this kind of unilateral control of everything in your sphere of influence without the need to actually interact with any other human beings (tiny or otherwise), would that be even more preferable? You'd get to eliminate even having to delegate anything, tell people what to do, try to communicate what you actually want in a way that they don't screw up or misinterpret you; it would essentially remove all human error. Maybe the tradeoff is even that you wouldn't be able to use it around others, you'd have to do it in isolation. Sort of like a Dr. Manhattan on Mars kind of situation?

Olo wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:48 pm
Over the years I have quite definitely used size fantasy to work through my personal insecurities and my dissatisfactions with the heterosexual roles assigned to me by society. I have believed that wanting to hold a shrunken woman in my hand or my mouth made me a misogynist. I have believed that wanting to be controlled and abused by a giant woman would absolve me of the guilt of being a straight man under the Patriarchy. I have accused myself of being an infantile escapist and considered cutting shrunken-man fantasies out of my life as a possible remedy.

It's really interesting to me how often this comes up, where some folks reach a point where the kink winds up making them ask a lot of introspective questions about themselves. (I wish it happened more on GTS City, holy fucking shit.) And I think this sense of guilt is really common for dudes who want to have fun sexually empowering themselves while also trying to be good allies to women, because society (both the toxic masculinity AND feminist sides) says it's not possible! People are talking about navigating that though, and it's really nice to see.

Like the society I was raised in, I was too terrified of my sexuality and gave it too much power. None of my real-life sexual relationships have involved size fantasy, but only because I was ashamed of it. I'd like to think that if I had discovered the internet and other size pervs at a much younger age, I might have come to terms with it and identified what needs it serves much earlier, but who really knows.

Maybe now it is, because the internet is much more kink friendly than it was even when I first turned 18 and started exploring, but my experience is still probably better than yours. I still hide a lot compared to younger people, and I keep things compartmentalized. But I hope whatever your trajectory was taught you some worthwhile life lessons, at least, and wasn't a completely miserable waste of time!

Given how personal and idiosyncratic everyone's experiences with size fantasy seems to be, it's a wonder we find anything useful or engaging at all in others' contributions, but we inarguably do. It is inconceivable to me what my size fantasies might have become without the last twenty-five years of swimming in online size smut. These days I think of my size fantasies as works of art, still in progress.

I know, it's really cool, actually. We all want to reach for this shared experience together.

by **Olo** » Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:48 pm

Kisupure wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:27 pm
It doesn't have to be a "if you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him" kind of thing, you don't have to conquer fetish by eliminating it from your life, but it's kind of like starting off in BDSM, starry-eyed and thirsty for all the rules, the roles, the tantalizing play, and then realizing that not everyone is 100% dominant or submissive all the time. Even dominants need shoulders to cry on sometimes as life threatens to overwhelm them.

The most important development in my life with size fantasy was realizing/deciding that it wasn't some mutation or defect within my sexuality that I needed to either accommodate or repress. Exploring size feelings is something I chose and continue to choose to do with my time and my mind. It can be as good or as bad a use of my time as any other diversion. As a lifelong pursuit, it is "part of me" but it does not define me or my sexuality.

Over the years I have quite definitely used size fantasy to work through my personal insecurities and my dissatisfactions with the heterosexual roles assigned to me by society. I have believed that wanting to hold a shrunken woman in my hand or my mouth made me a misogynist. I have believed that wanting to be controlled and abused by a giant woman would absolve me of the guilt of being a straight man under the Patriarchy. I have accused myself of being an infantile escapist and considered cutting shrunken-man fantasies out of my life as a possible remedy.

I have been into fantasy role-playing games almost as long as I've been having size feelings, so I really should have figured out earlier that size is just another fantasy world in which I enjoy expressing myself. Like the society I was raised in, I was too terrified of my sexuality and gave it too much power. None of my real-life sexual relationships have involved size fantasy, but only because I was ashamed of it. I'd like to think that if I had discovered the internet and other size pervs at a much younger age, I might have come to terms with it and identified what needs it serves much earlier, but who really knows.

Given how personal and idiosyncratic everyone's experiences with size fantasy seems to be, it's a wonder we find anything useful or engaging at all in others' contributions, but we inarguably do. It is inconceivable to me what my size fantasies might have become without the last twenty-five years of swimming in online size smut. These days I think of my size fantasies as works of art, still in progress.

To bring this back to the original question: I want my size fantasies to depict realistic people plausibly negotiating unrealistic and implausible size differentials. I want to see them consider the possibilities of size difference and to confront what those considerations reveal about themselves. Plausibly, some people will indulge their inner appetites and some people will affirm their principles, and I want to see both extremes and everything in between.

by **i am insane** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:39 pm

Hmm. For me, this fetish has always revolved around power; mainly the fact I want it, and more than is actual achievable in the train wreck that is the real world

If I hold someone, literally, in my hand, I have power over them, some of the most basic, primal power imaginable, and to me, that's very exciting. I want that, and quite frankly I've always wanted it, even as a child that had no idea, much less interest, in sex or anything like it. It took different forms, of course, but dragons and giants hold similar thematics: large, strong, unstoppable. Even now, I'm less attached than most to the idea of being human, or honestly, even male, than the idea of being that powerful.

i know there's sayings out there that boil down to 'power begs to be used', and I get that, but to me that's not always true. Using that power, squeezing that hand no matter what the woman inside it is thinking, is exciting, sure, but it's not what I really want: if I ended up as a giant, even if I could, with no consequences like jail or whatever, take a woman and keep her in a jar, I wouldn't do that, and it's not even just about moral reasons; honestly, I just don't want to be an asshole like that and hurt people. More than anything, I want the choice of doing that, because if I'm the one making the decision, it means that no one else is making the decision about what I'm doing for me.

I've thought about this kind of thing a lot, and to me, power can really be reduced to simply that: choice. The ability to make a decision and then do it, no matter what anyone or anything else may say. It's the reason that, given the option, I'd go giant rather than having an SW, even if I'd lose some of the luxuries I have now.

Attention... I've got to say I've never thought of it that way. I'm not crazy for attention, to be sure, but I won't say I don't want any, either. Certainly something to think about. It plays into what I've been saying, the idea of taking that attention, but it honestly sounds... I don't know how to say it, superficial? Or sort of like empty calories? Like it would be interesting for a little bit, but then the fun of it would wear off and leave you with the reality of the situation weighing you down.

by **Kisupure** » Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:27 pm

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:36 am

Nicodemus wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:26 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:54 am

I can't really say I dislike the victimization because that is a huge part of the power dynamics. I can certainly appreciate it, though, I also know it is 100% on me to state my hard and soft limits and when to say stop. That's totally on me, just like it is on the larger person to do the same with me. This is why consent and conversation are so important.

As always, I tend to overthink a lot of things and I noticed over the years that misogyny is a huge part of not just this fetish but numerous ones. It is not my obligation educate people as to why that's bad, nor would I, but I do heavily consider my contributions when I write. I find myself asking if the behaviors could contribute negatively to someone's mental state. I don't have to and I'm aware of that and am not obligated to do anything in regards to how someone else behaves due to my work. But, it is still something I do think about and do try to find ways to resolve on my own in my own ways so that I am not worried about any impact.

Consent between adults will never be an issue, whether in rp or in real life. My feelings about what is enjoyed is absolutely none of my business unless I'm asked. It's my own impact on others that I concern myself with.
Interesting point.

Victimization, the snatching away of personal choice (pun intended) is somewhat universal in a number of fetishes. Bondage, R-play, D/s, M/s, O/p. I liken it, in terms of play, to a spook house or roller coaster, we wish to be shocked, frightened and even repulsed in some instances, but all within the safety of consent and fantasy. We know the ghost charging at us is nothing more that gauze and glue or some actor in a costume, but for a brief moment our instincts are triggered, offering an adrenaline rush.

For my perspective, I agree, the trope becomes dull and predictable when relied upon to give the entirety of the rush, but we also know, in this unique fantasy of SW, the size differences do limit the activities one can engage. While this is not exclusive to this dynamic, after all, how many times can one be tied and spanked while keeping it fresh? This is why I enjoy a good shock most of all, a dark and twisted tale or one of such wild imagination where I can not predict what may come next.

I would not say I dislike "victimization," but I would say that variety is essential. Lobster every day can become boring.
I think, at least for me, it became essential for me to understand why I have this fetish and why my.btain decided it equated to emotional and psychological needs I have. It was also important so that I could process all that into a healthy relationship as opposed to what I had been doing. I don't know if that is a unique experience for me alone, or if that is true of everyone, but it is something that I had to do to move forward with comfort about the fetish. It also helps with diminishing expectations, which was a very liberating thing for me. It also helped me accept the idea of victimization was being interpreted in my mind as a fulfillment of a need, even though it might be a really strange connection. Ow that I've been able to process a lot of the connections and understand my own psyche, I find that my own interests in the fetish have changed and perhaps grown, which is oddly rewarding.

Victimization in fetish is very much a balm for a wound. I think we all know what kind of wound it is: the desire to be loved and appreciated. From the POV of the aggressor, you have the full attention of your tiny captive; they are fully dialed into your needs and wants, not because it necessarily excites them, but because those needs and wants can be the difference between a pleasurable encounter or a deadly one. You are appreciated as a threat: "If I cannot inspire love, I will cause fear”.

As the victim, the analogue is true: captivity and fear can very easily be twisted into something resembling safety and love. This happens all the time in the real world, unfortunately. But in fetish, we try to reclaim it turn the ugly reality into something palatable, something controlled, domesticated. By directing every moment of a dangerous encounter through visual composition in images, pacing and dialogue in written stories, we choreograph every moving part and are no longer threatened by it. We have a god's eye view and know from the outset whether all the pieces will come together happily or horrifically. The fantasy can't hurt us. Think of the Flash being able to slow down time and casually walk through the flying pieces of metal of a car crash, see how and where everything is going, manipulate people and objects in media res, guiding them through to a safer trajectory. (Yes I saw the Snyder Justice League. Holy shit it was terrible.)

There's a ton of misogyny in fetish, but I can now speak with confidence that there's a lot of misandry too: men don't get to have emotions and flaws in a lot of porn either, which echoes many real world problems men face with emotional isolation and abuse. But that's the point of fetish for most people, to reduce human beings to superficial playthings, symbols, setpieces, that they can position just so like a sexual diorama in their heads, and achieve absolution. I think, spend enough time in a fetish community, contribute to it enough, interact respectfully with enough other people in it, and you realize this eventually. It doesn't have to be a "if you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him" kind of thing, you don't have to conquer fetish by eliminating it from your life, but it's kind of like starting off in BDSM, starry-eyed and thirsty for all the rules, the roles, the tantalizing play, and then realizing that not everyone is 100% dominant or submissive all the time. Even dominants need shoulders to cry on sometimes as life threatens to overwhelm them. Rejecting that in favor of an inhuman aesthetic is where toxic behavior comes from. Preferring the institution over the human beings in it is what ends up moving someone away from empathetic thought patterns in real life.

But accepting and embracing it is where a lot of personal growth can come from too.

by **Cariwebo** » Sun Mar 21, 2021 8:32 pm

Many, many wonderful insights in this thread!

by **Nicodemus** » Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:57 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:36 am

Nicodemus wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:26 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:54 am

I can't really say I dislike the victimization because that is a huge part of the power dynamics. I can certainly appreciate it, though, I also know it is 100% on me to state my hard and soft limits and when to say stop. That's totally on me, just like it is on the larger person to do the same with me. This is why consent and conversation are so important.

As always, I tend to overthink a lot of things and I noticed over the years that misogyny is a huge part of not just this fetish but numerous ones. It is not my obligation educate people as to why that's bad, nor would I, but I do heavily consider my contributions when I write. I find myself asking if the behaviors could contribute negatively to someone's mental state. I don't have to and I'm aware of that and am not obligated to do anything in regards to how someone else behaves due to my work. But, it is still something I do think about and do try to find ways to resolve on my own in my own ways so that I am not worried about any impact.

Consent between adults will never be an issue, whether in rp or in real life. My feelings about what is enjoyed is absolutely none of my business unless I'm asked. It's my own impact on others that I concern myself with.
Interesting point.

Victimization, the snatching away of personal choice (pun intended) is somewhat universal in a number of fetishes. Bondage, R-play, D/s, M/s, O/p. I liken it, in terms of play, to a spook house or roller coaster, we wish to be shocked, frightened and even repulsed in some instances, but all within the safety of consent and fantasy. We know the ghost charging at us is nothing more that gauze and glue or some actor in a costume, but for a brief moment our instincts are triggered, offering an adrenaline rush.

For my perspective, I agree, the trope becomes dull and predictable when relied upon to give the entirety of the rush, but we also know, in this unique fantasy of SW, the size differences do limit the activities one can engage. While this is not exclusive to this dynamic, after all, how many times can one be tied and spanked while keeping it fresh? This is why I enjoy a good shock most of all, a dark and twisted tale or one of such wild imagination where I can not predict what may come next.

I would not say I dislike "victimization," but I would say that variety is essential. Lobster every day can become boring.
I think, at least for me, it became essential for me to understand why I have this fetish and why my.btain decided it equated to emotional and psychological needs I have. It was also important so that I could process all that into a healthy relationship as opposed to what I had been doing. I don't know if that is a unique experience for me alone, or if that is true of everyone, but it is something that I had to do to move forward with comfort about the fetish. It also helps with diminishing expectations, which was a very liberating thing for me. It also helped me accept the idea of victimization was being interpreted in my mind as a fulfillment of a need, even though it might be a really strange connection. Ow that I've been able to process a lot of the connections and understand my own psyche, I find that my own interests in the fetish have changed and perhaps grown, which is oddly rewarding.

I like that.

Nice to see someone put a fetish or fantasy to good, actual use in their life.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:36 am

Nicodemus wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:26 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:54 am

i am insane wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:25 pm

Oh no, you're far from the only one to notice the victimization thing, or to dislike it. There's a thread somewhere on here where a bunch of men on this board confess how awkward this fetish makes them at times, myself included.
I can't really say I dislike the victimization because that is a huge part of the power dynamics. I can certainly appreciate it, though, I also know it is 100% on me to state my hard and soft limits and when to say stop. That's totally on me, just like it is on the larger person to do the same with me. This is why consent and conversation are so important.

As always, I tend to overthink a lot of things and I noticed over the years that misogyny is a huge part of not just this fetish but numerous ones. It is not my obligation educate people as to why that's bad, nor would I, but I do heavily consider my contributions when I write. I find myself asking if the behaviors could contribute negatively to someone's mental state. I don't have to and I'm aware of that and am not obligated to do anything in regards to how someone else behaves due to my work. But, it is still something I do think about and do try to find ways to resolve on my own in my own ways so that I am not worried about any impact.

Consent between adults will never be an issue, whether in rp or in real life. My feelings about what is enjoyed is absolutely none of my business unless I'm asked. It's my own impact on others that I concern myself with.
Interesting point.

Victimization, the snatching away of personal choice (pun intended) is somewhat universal in a number of fetishes. Bondage, R-play, D/s, M/s, O/p. I liken it, in terms of play, to a spook house or roller coaster, we wish to be shocked, frightened and even repulsed in some instances, but all within the safety of consent and fantasy. We know the ghost charging at us is nothing more that gauze and glue or some actor in a costume, but for a brief moment our instincts are triggered, offering an adrenaline rush.

For my perspective, I agree, the trope becomes dull and predictable when relied upon to give the entirety of the rush, but we also know, in this unique fantasy of SW, the size differences do limit the activities one can engage. While this is not exclusive to this dynamic, after all, how many times can one be tied and spanked while keeping it fresh? This is why I enjoy a good shock most of all, a dark and twisted tale or one of such wild imagination where I can not predict what may come next.

I would not say I dislike "victimization," but I would say that variety is essential. Lobster every day can become boring.

I think, at least for me, it became essential for me to understand why I have this fetish and why my.btain decided it equated to emotional and psychological needs I have. It was also important so that I could process all that into a healthy relationship as opposed to what I had been doing. I don't know if that is a unique experience for me alone, or if that is true of everyone, but it is something that I had to do to move forward with comfort about the fetish. It also helps with diminishing expectations, which was a very liberating thing for me. It also helped me accept the idea of victimization was being interpreted in my mind as a fulfillment of a need, even though it might be a really strange connection. Ow that I've been able to process a lot of the connections and understand my own psyche, I find that my own interests in the fetish have changed and perhaps grown, which is oddly rewarding.

by **Nicodemus** » Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:26 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:54 am

i am insane wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:25 pm

Oh no, you're far from the only one to notice the victimization thing, or to dislike it. There's a thread somewhere on here where a bunch of men on this board confess how awkward this fetish makes them at times, myself included.
I can't really say I dislike the victimization because that is a huge part of the power dynamics. I can certainly appreciate it, though, I also know it is 100% on me to state my hard and soft limits and when to say stop. That's totally on me, just like it is on the larger person to do the same with me. This is why consent and conversation are so important.

As always, I tend to overthink a lot of things and I noticed over the years that misogyny is a huge part of not just this fetish but numerous ones. It is not my obligation educate people as to why that's bad, nor would I, but I do heavily consider my contributions when I write. I find myself asking if the behaviors could contribute negatively to someone's mental state. I don't have to and I'm aware of that and am not obligated to do anything in regards to how someone else behaves due to my work. But, it is still something I do think about and do try to find ways to resolve on my own in my own ways so that I am not worried about any impact.

Consent between adults will never be an issue, whether in rp or in real life. My feelings about what is enjoyed is absolutely none of my business unless I'm asked. It's my own impact on others that I concern myself with.

Interesting point.

Victimization, the snatching away of personal choice (pun intended) is somewhat universal in a number of fetishes. Bondage, R-play, D/s, M/s, O/p. I liken it, in terms of play, to a spook house or roller coaster, we wish to be shocked, frightened and even repulsed in some instances, but all within the safety of consent and fantasy. We know the ghost charging at us is nothing more that gauze and glue or some actor in a costume, but for a brief moment our instincts are triggered, offering an adrenaline rush.

For my perspective, I agree, the trope becomes dull and predictable when relied upon to give the entirety of the rush, but we also know, in this unique fantasy of SW, the size differences do limit the activities one can engage. While this is not exclusive to this dynamic, after all, how many times can one be tied and spanked while keeping it fresh? This is why I enjoy a good shock most of all, a dark and twisted tale or one of such wild imagination where I can not predict what may come next.

I would not say I dislike "victimization," but I would say that variety is essential. Lobster every day can become boring.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:54 am

i am insane wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:25 pm

Oh no, you're far from the only one to notice the victimization thing, or to dislike it. There's a thread somewhere on here where a bunch of men on this board confess how awkward this fetish makes them at times, myself included.

I can't really say I dislike the victimization because that is a huge part of the power dynamics. I can certainly appreciate it, though, I also know it is 100% on me to state my hard and soft limits and when to say stop. That's totally on me, just like it is on the larger person to do the same with me. This is why consent and conversation are so important.

As always, I tend to overthink a lot of things and I noticed over the years that misogyny is a huge part of not just this fetish but numerous ones. It is not my obligation educate people as to why that's bad, nor would I, but I do heavily consider my contributions when I write. I find myself asking if the behaviors could contribute negatively to someone's mental state. I don't have to and I'm aware of that and am not obligated to do anything in regards to how someone else behaves due to my work. But, it is still something I do think about and do try to find ways to resolve on my own in my own ways so that I am not worried about any impact.

Consent between adults will never be an issue, whether in rp or in real life. My feelings about what is enjoyed is absolutely none of my business unless I'm asked. It's my own impact on others that I concern myself with.

by **Kisupure** » Fri Mar 19, 2021 11:02 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:25 pm

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 6:54 pm

Kisupure wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 5:22 pm

I've always loved futzing with these kinds of questions, because for me they're apt metaphors for power relations in the real world. They cease to just be fetish, they become allegory. What is a power dynamic? What do they look and feel like? How do they function? How asymmetrical can they get before breaking? Can they be fluid, fluctuating things? Can a giant have power one minute, and be stripped of it the next? What happens when a big doesn't want contextual power over a tiny? What role does the outside world play, especially if that world doesn't revolve around fetish logic where everyone is beautiful and horny and no one has to go work in the morning or pick their grandma up from chemo?

Fetish to me is at its most interesting, compelling, and sexy when it comes into contact with something that resembles reality. Fetish by itself is almost unsatisfactory to me now... it's too glossy and lubed up, there's nothing for me to get a grip on and hold. Stories that are designed to be looked at rather than turned over in one's proverbial hands are forgettable and unfulfilling. I need characters, I need themes. Give me a few nutritional calories along with the junk, at least.
I agree! The sexual aspect is fun, but after a while, it becomes repetitive and really kind of disheartening when one considers it is based mostly on victimization. I sometimes have a difficult time reconciling that the fetish needs victims to be arousing. (I realize this is solely a me issue. People like what they like, and while I understand the fetish, it still is something I personally find difficult to deal with.)

I'd like to believe that real life would create a different set of rules, so to speak. People still need to work, exist, function. Even more so when you have a tiny person, unless your intention is to neglect them completely until they die.

People are complex. Being tiny doesn't change that complexity and doesn't change what we dwell on, whether it be some asshole at work, that bill that needs to be paid or whatever life creates and having a tiny person doesn't change those things either.

The sex is fine, but the fetish really dehumanizes the reality. I would rather it be introduced that excluded, as that is a major part of story and world building.
Oh no, you're far from the only one to notice the victimization thing, or to dislike it. There's a thread somewhere on here where a bunch of men on this board confess how awkward this fetish makes them at times, myself included.

It's weird coming at this from the Other Side now, as someone that buried their sadistic impulses for a looooong time because it made me feel like a "bad sub". Embracing that in a way that's liberating is a REALLY fine line to walk, especially since my goal is to read as a cis male, and I think I'm going to need to get much more actively involved in my local kink community so I can learn to be an ethical person if I have someone handing me the reigns. It's a whole different interpersonal skillset.

That's why I also bring BDSM ways of doing things into my stories a lot, characters ask questions of each other because they're real people. Even when the consent is dubious, I try to build arrangements that at least make sense in a characterization sense, so that it's not just kink scenes strung together. I want a trajectory, I want my giants and tinies to learn things about each other over the course of their encounter, even if what they learn is ugly or unsettling. I enjoy victimization in certain contexts, but I also want to write in a way that lets the reader know that choices have consequences.

Azure you're right though in that focusing purely on the dopamine hit of sex gets old after a while!

by **i am insane** » Fri Mar 19, 2021 10:25 pm

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 6:54 pm

Kisupure wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 5:22 pm

I've always loved futzing with these kinds of questions, because for me they're apt metaphors for power relations in the real world. They cease to just be fetish, they become allegory. What is a power dynamic? What do they look and feel like? How do they function? How asymmetrical can they get before breaking? Can they be fluid, fluctuating things? Can a giant have power one minute, and be stripped of it the next? What happens when a big doesn't want contextual power over a tiny? What role does the outside world play, especially if that world doesn't revolve around fetish logic where everyone is beautiful and horny and no one has to go work in the morning or pick their grandma up from chemo?

Fetish to me is at its most interesting, compelling, and sexy when it comes into contact with something that resembles reality. Fetish by itself is almost unsatisfactory to me now... it's too glossy and lubed up, there's nothing for me to get a grip on and hold. Stories that are designed to be looked at rather than turned over in one's proverbial hands are forgettable and unfulfilling. I need characters, I need themes. Give me a few nutritional calories along with the junk, at least.
I agree! The sexual aspect is fun, but after a while, it becomes repetitive and really kind of disheartening when one considers it is based mostly on victimization. I sometimes have a difficult time reconciling that the fetish needs victims to be arousing. (I realize this is solely a me issue. People like what they like, and while I understand the fetish, it still is something I personally find difficult to deal with.)

I'd like to believe that real life would create a different set of rules, so to speak. People still need to work, exist, function. Even more so when you have a tiny person, unless your intention is to neglect them completely until they die.

People are complex. Being tiny doesn't change that complexity and doesn't change what we dwell on, whether it be some asshole at work, that bill that needs to be paid or whatever life creates and having a tiny person doesn't change those things either.

The sex is fine, but the fetish really dehumanizes the reality. I would rather it be introduced that excluded, as that is a major part of story and world building.

Oh no, you're far from the only one to notice the victimization thing, or to dislike it. There's a thread somewhere on here where a bunch of men on this board confess how awkward this fetish makes them at times, myself included.

by **azureeyes** » Fri Mar 19, 2021 6:54 pm

Kisupure wrote: ↑
Fri Mar 19, 2021 5:22 pm

I've always loved futzing with these kinds of questions, because for me they're apt metaphors for power relations in the real world. They cease to just be fetish, they become allegory. What is a power dynamic? What do they look and feel like? How do they function? How asymmetrical can they get before breaking? Can they be fluid, fluctuating things? Can a giant have power one minute, and be stripped of it the next? What happens when a big doesn't want contextual power over a tiny? What role does the outside world play, especially if that world doesn't revolve around fetish logic where everyone is beautiful and horny and no one has to go work in the morning or pick their grandma up from chemo?

Fetish to me is at its most interesting, compelling, and sexy when it comes into contact with something that resembles reality. Fetish by itself is almost unsatisfactory to me now... it's too glossy and lubed up, there's nothing for me to get a grip on and hold. Stories that are designed to be looked at rather than turned over in one's proverbial hands are forgettable and unfulfilling. I need characters, I need themes. Give me a few nutritional calories along with the junk, at least.

I agree! The sexual aspect is fun, but after a while, it becomes repetitive and really kind of disheartening when one considers it is based mostly on victimization. I sometimes have a difficult time reconciling that the fetish needs victims to be arousing. (I realize this is solely a me issue. People like what they like, and while I understand the fetish, it still is something I personally find difficult to deal with.)

I'd like to believe that real life would create a different set of rules, so to speak. People still need to work, exist, function. Even more so when you have a tiny person, unless your intention is to neglect them completely until they die.

People are complex. Being tiny doesn't change that complexity and doesn't change what we dwell on, whether it be some asshole at work, that bill that needs to be paid or whatever life creates and having a tiny person doesn't change those things either.

The sex is fine, but the fetish really dehumanizes the reality. I would rather it be introduced that excluded, as that is a major part of story and world building.

by **Kisupure** » Fri Mar 19, 2021 5:22 pm

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:27 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:13 pm
Power and what people do with it. Not just the women losing power, but also a big woman submitting to a smaller one, because there's someone bigger still supporting them, or a man obey a shrunken woman because of desire or obligations, and so on.

What they'll do for what reason, how far someone will go until they reach some sort of limit.... these things fascinate me.
I always find this an interesting angle. Who is going to be the person more in charge? Because it's assumed the tiny person will be relinquishing her(their) power, but that may not always be the case. What about the friend who wants to help them discover what it's like being small? Or the one who wants to help figure out how to get them back to normal? The power structure is different and it doesn't mean as time goes on, one person doesn't realize the advantages over the other and what would they do with that realization?

It's a very rarely explored aspect of SW, I think, where the SW has more power or there is a bit more power equity on her side.

I've always loved futzing with these kinds of questions, because for me they're apt metaphors for power relations in the real world. They cease to just be fetish, they become allegory. What is a power dynamic? What do they look and feel like? How do they function? How asymmetrical can they get before breaking? Can they be fluid, fluctuating things? Can a giant have power one minute, and be stripped of it the next? What happens when a big doesn't want contextual power over a tiny? What role does the outside world play, especially if that world doesn't revolve around fetish logic where everyone is beautiful and horny and no one has to go work in the morning or pick their grandma up from chemo?

Fetish to me is at its most interesting, compelling, and sexy when it comes into contact with something that resembles reality. Fetish by itself is almost unsatisfactory to me now... it's too glossy and lubed up, there's nothing for me to get a grip on and hold. Stories that are designed to be looked at rather than turned over in one's proverbial hands are forgettable and unfulfilling. I need characters, I need themes. Give me a few nutritional calories along with the junk, at least.

by **BigManEd** » Thu Mar 18, 2021 12:52 am

Hmmmmm, that's tough. I love all matter of shrinking stories. Of course I do have my favourite themes and ideas. One of my most favourite it probably when the lovely lady is shrunk by a guy that they would never be caught dead with or perhaps somone that is incredibly shady. I do always enjoy a feisty attitude from the women who are shrunk. Even though they are the size of a toy now that does not deter the amount of spunk and sas they still have. Then perhaps one of my more nefarious desires is when the situation in question is taboo or not necessarily accepted by society. Mother and son stories, teen and adult stories and sometimes even animal and beautiful woman. I love all matter of SW stories, I'm not very picky :p

by **Nicodemus** » Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:34 am

For me, above all, originality. Some plot point or such that has not been tread time and again. Pushing limits also fascinates me in a story.

by **azureeyes** » Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:16 am

Aussie_Lurker wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:58 am

Well yeah, that's why I specifically picked people like Moms, Teachers & Babysitters as examples. They have a degree of power and authority over those under their care, part of which stems from them being quite a bit taller than the people in their care. If they shrink to a size of 6" to 24" tall, clearly their ability to wield any authority will be completely lost. It's why I love that specific sub-genre of shrinking woman fantasy. I especially love universes, like that of Sumguy's "She's Asking for it" (seriously, he REALLY need to continue that story ), where there is a "Finders, Keepers" law for unregistered minis.....hope that helps to explain things a bit more.

So for you, the age/power already established is important, if I read that correctly. That's fair. This isn't about making any judgement calls on morality/ethics or anything like that. People like what they like. I was more curious of it expanded to perceived power or other than established power already installed.

by **Aussie_Lurker** » Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:58 am

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:24 pm

Aussie_Lurker wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 1:29 am
For me, though, my favourite Shrinking Trope is the one that results in a significant reversal in the "balance of power".
slepytyme wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:12 am
I have to agree with aussie the power dynamics mean alot to me ,the loss of control and relinquish of power is intoxicating. Having a tiny give up all or relinquish their control to a big is very nice. To only give up their old lives to be a pet is scintillating. I just enjoy the power dynamic change
Okay, so now I have to ask, this assumes that previously she had some power before being shrunk. I get with Aussie's examples, but what if those aren't the case? Does this mean her personality is more powerful at the start? Or is it a perceived power by the person shrinking her, in that, she really doesn't have power, but she has led the shrinker to believe she does? Or does a mutual agreement of mutual equity also count as a changed play of power where her new role brings out a submissive side she's been holding? Must it always be a women who has power, or can it be more of a psychological perception of power?

Fwiw, I too love power transfers in SW. I love the dynamic that happens with the whole trope.

Well yeah, that's why I specifically picked people like Moms, Teachers & Babysitters as examples. They have a degree of power and authority over those under their care, part of which stems from them being quite a bit taller than the people in their care. If they shrink to a size of 6" to 24" tall, clearly their ability to wield any authority will be completely lost. It's why I love that specific sub-genre of shrinking woman fantasy. I especially love universes, like that of Sumguy's "She's Asking for it" (seriously, he REALLY need to continue that story

), where there is a "Finders, Keepers" law for unregistered minis.....hope that helps to explain things a bit more.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:24 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:02 pm
More recently, on the new other board, Theophilious (of all people, WTF)...

This honestly made me lol!

If had to hazard a guess, a lot of us in the community are getting older and our tastes or views have either changed, grown or expanded into other areas we might not have considered interesting a while back. Maybe?

by **i am insane** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:02 pm

azureeyes wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:27 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:13 pm
Power and what people do with it. Not just the women losing power, but also a big woman submitting to a smaller one, because there's someone bigger still supporting them, or a man obey a shrunken woman because of desire or obligations, and so on.

What they'll do for what reason, how far someone will go until they reach some sort of limit.... these things fascinate me.
I always find this an interesting angle. Who is going to be the person more in charge? Because it's assumed the tiny person will be relinquishing her(their) power, but that may not always be the case. What about the friend who wants to help them discover what it's like being small? Or the one who wants to help figure out how to get them back to normal? The power structure is different and it doesn't mean as time goes on, one person doesn't realize the advantages over the other and what would they do with that realization?

It's a very rarely explored aspect of SW, I think, where the SW has more power or there is a bit more power equity on her side.

Yes, it's pretty damn rare. I'm trying to dabble in it a bit right now, actully, though the actual result is... less clear. I know Missletowe had stories with that kind of concept, and just generally stories where the giant/normal treat the woman/en like people with actual agency and choice.

More recently, on the new other board, Theophilious (of all people, WTF) has an almost parody like story where the woman is trying to seduce the naive giant.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:56 pm

I realized I didn't answer this myself!

I love interaction between characters. I like it when it seems real and organic and not a vehicle to lead to a scene. I like to watch them as they work with each other, discover new things and build a relationship in this new scenario.

I have been working on my own stories to perfect details, describing things like sensations, visual aspects, emotions. These make it more alive to me, allowing me to put myself more into the story than lines like "he moved his finger against her". How did it look from his perspective? What was he hoping for? Was he happy with her reaction? I love the idea of the exploring with the characters as opposed to just looking in. To be invested in their journey as much as they are.

I like stories that make me think and/or experience them. I think those are important for my enjoyment. I can handle most tropes as long as they aren't mechanically written, though I stop at violence and masochism simply because it can exist. If you give me a strong motivation and background of the characters, I may be willing to go along depending on how much I empathize with them.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:30 pm

foreverlurk wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:15 pm
For me there's also an important humiliation aspect, I'm not talking about degrading or cruel punishments, but rather the implication that the SW doesn't want to be seen by anyone in that state. She doesn't want to be picked up, looked upon as a freak or taken advantage or. Even worse of course if she shrank out of her clothes, which then blends with the ENF (Embarrassed Naked Female) trope.

So hiding, hoping not to be seen by an enemy/rival, hoping to get back to normal without anyone noticing, that sort of stuff.

I can see that. I think that becomes the primary trope once the shock/horror/excitement wears off and reality sets in.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:27 pm

i am insane wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:13 pm
Power and what people do with it. Not just the women losing power, but also a big woman submitting to a smaller one, because there's someone bigger still supporting them, or a man obey a shrunken woman because of desire or obligations, and so on.

What they'll do for what reason, how far someone will go until they reach some sort of limit.... these things fascinate me.

I always find this an interesting angle. Who is going to be the person more in charge? Because it's assumed the tiny person will be relinquishing her(their) power, but that may not always be the case. What about the friend who wants to help them discover what it's like being small? Or the one who wants to help figure out how to get them back to normal? The power structure is different and it doesn't mean as time goes on, one person doesn't realize the advantages over the other and what would they do with that realization?

It's a very rarely explored aspect of SW, I think, where the SW has more power or there is a bit more power equity on her side.

by **azureeyes** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:23 pm

Hand-Holder wrote: ↑
Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:43 pm
Clothes play, so clothes shrinking with minis

Any story, even a very interesting one, that arrives to that point where a woman gets shrunked and goes instantly naked, I stop reading...

Clothes should be shrunk also and never ripped off quickly, but little by little, along the story...

A mini should go to a naked state right in the end or even maybe never...

I love the idea of having clothes on and bring shrunk with them changing size with me. A lot of the sexual tension, for me, at least, is being made to feel normal and have interactions that are "normal" and provide a sense of security and growing trust.

I don't have problems with shrink and grab or shrinking out of clothes, if the sole purpose is to create a story where sex is the main objective, but I do lose interest in them fairly quickly.

by **foreverlurk** » Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:15 pm

For me there's also an important humiliation aspect, I'm not talking about degrading or cruel punishments, but rather the implication that the SW doesn't want to be seen by anyone in that state. She doesn't want to be picked up, looked upon as a freak or taken advantage or. Even worse of course if she shrank out of her clothes, which then blends with the ENF (Embarrassed Naked Female) trope.

So hiding, hoping not to be seen by an enemy/rival, hoping to get back to normal without anyone noticing, that sort of stuff.

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